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1. The assumption here is that if you are a "Calvinist" you are therefore "for Calvin." And people like Doug will say that therefore "Calvin is your God" and "you are a cult." And for good measure he also threw the Lutherans and Mennonites under the bus. Might I remind our Arminian friends (yes - that's what you are) that the term Calvinist didn't develop because John Calvin thought up a new Biblical doctrine, but because Calvin was one of a few men God led to spark the Protestant Reformation, finding again true Biblical doctrines that had been lost by man and suppressed by the Roman Catholic Church. In this sense and by this standard, one could call Apostle Paul and St. Augustine both "Calvinists." This is why Calvinists prefer the term "Reformed" so that we need not take the name of a man... but Calvinist-haters (which, like Doug, are people that have a problem with any type of theology in general) will not release us from that nomenclature.
I might add to Doug or any other Calvinist stone-thrower that I might call you an "Arminian" because you hold to the doctrines of Justin Arminius. Or would that be unfair, to assume that because you hold doctrines held by another, more famous theologian that you are therefore "in his cult?"
2. To make divisions such as "Calvinist," "Arminian," or my favorite - 'ignoramus" - then you are somehow divisive or factious. This is probably the complaint towards my Reformed brethren that I hear most..."you Calvinist guys sure are argumentative!"
Correct me if I'm wrong, but wouldn't it seem that soteriology would be the ONE topic in all of Scripture in which to argue about? As long as it is done in love, then it is vitally important to pound out true salvation doctrine from Scripture. If you get the Gospel wrong, you've gotten it all wrong. I believe one can trace all false models of theology, ecclesiology, conservative and liberal - to a misguided understanding of salvation. Salvation-by-works (my Pentecostal friends) or salvation-by-prayer (my Baptist friends) all stem from an immature attempt at "getting" salvation. We argue about salvation because it is essential.
3. Incredibly ignorant people, when discussing various schools of theology, will often say "no one is entirely correct." Let me translate this to mean, "I should spend more time studying and less time preaching, because I'm not really sure what correct theology is so I'm just going to say 'nobody's entirely correct.'" Well, what do you believe, then? These people would rather focus on the ABCs of Christian faith such as "God is love" and "Jesus is good" and ignore the vast richness of the writings of Paul - because it takes a little study and diligence to get a grasp on good theology. I've come to understand a long time ago that people hate Calvinists because "they think they have it all figured out," not realizing the average Calvinist has taken tens of thousands of hours toiling over the Bible in an honest pursuit of reconciling grace and free will. The average Arminian (in my opinion) has spent about ten hours thinking up pithy logical arguments about how Calvinism refutes God's character or finding "Scriptural one-liners" - like "it's God's will none perish" - that they can pull out of context so they can avoid entire chapters on the doctrine of election like Romans 9. Bonus: This guy calls theology "vanity." Really? Biblical teaching is "vanity."
I could not possibly begin to understand or grasp neither the sovereignty of God nor the Glory of God without immersing myself in Reformed theology. I had no idea the Scripture was so rich, so wonderful, so life-changing. I could not grasp the meaning of "Amazing Grace" or the wonder of my own salvation, or the goodness of God without it. I praise God daily for giving me just a glimpse into this wonderful, Biblical doctrine.
2 comments:
Just a few thoughts...
1. Calvinists don't hear God? They don't let Him direct their paths? I know he isn't going to look at scripture to debate this issue but my Bible says that God's word, ie. the BIBLE! directs our path. The voices in our heads/hearts, if from God, will not contradict scripture. I listen to and follow the voice of God daily by reading my Bible, not just in prayer. And if following the teachings of men is wrong, then the entire NT church is in need of repentance since scripture says that they devoted themselves to the apostles teaching.
2. Church history comes in handy during these discussions. Calvin did not write what we now call the "Five Points" of Calvinism. They were written as a rebuttal against the Five Points of Jacob Arminius by The Synod of Dordt in the years 1618-19. John Calvin died in 1564. While he did preach and teach these doctrines, he did not sit down and come up with the fancy acronym TULIP. The reason men like Luther and Calvin are given credit for the Reformation is because they made the greatest strides to bring the church back to Biblical principles. While the Catholic Church opposed them, many came to true faith because of their work.
3. Anytime someone starts off a conversation by saying "We are not going to look at what scripture says.", what they really mean is "I don't care what the Bible says." As someone who grew up in an "Arminian" church, and taught to prove "Calvinism" wrong, I found myself unable to reconcile the concepts of issues like predestination, eternal security, perserverance of the saints, irresistable grace, and so on. Why? Because you can't explain them away! For each verse used in an Arminian argument, there are ten to support the other side. When asked how to explain the verse "Anyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved" is quite easy. Who will then call on the Lord? "As many as the Lord will call." The reason so many get upset and angered at predestination is because even in Greek, predestined means, here's a shocker, predestined. It doesn't change.
4. This is really an argument that started 300 years AFTER Christ died. Piper's, Calvin's, Luther's, Augustine's, Paul's, theology concerning these matters agree with one another and with what Christ taught. But we don't want to talk about a Jesus who would actually tell someone they are going to hell though would we?
5. I am not arrogant enough to say that I am the most important aspect of my salvation, which is what free will doctrine truly teaches. If salvation is brought about by my choosing then
a) I can unchoose salvation
b) Salvation is then based on works and not grace. The entire book of Ephesians is wrong.
c) God is not sovereign and all powerful because he would then not know the outcome. He can only sit back and simply hope for the one of us to "choose" His son. So then what about verses that deal with God's forknowledge? Acknowledge the rest of the passages when it deals with predestined, called, etc. Hermeneutics 101, let scripture interpret scripture.
6. I am getting annoyed by the name calling and inferences made by people concerning Calvinists. First off, the label is something other people have labeled us as. It is how others refer to us. Second, we are accused of being arrogant and devisive, and argumentative. Yet, here we find someone who is simply slamming people who have a true love for God and His word. Who is devisive and not being one in the spirit?
Dude, what a thesis. Absolutely correct, though.
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